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Олменд местный житель
в ответ Leo_lisard 21.07.04 23:59, Последний раз изменено 22.07.04 10:03 (Олменд)
"....на одном говорит 99% эстонцев, а на другом несколько десятков эстонцев-сету, населяющих несколько деревень в Южной Эстонии и в Псковской области России."
Знаете, Лизард, у меня большие сомнения по поводу ваших знаний эстонских диалектов. Я не нашел точных цифр, но из того, что я нашел в инете ясно видно, что южный и северный эстонский диалект многие ученые даже рассматривают как два различных языка, южноэстонский был намного шире распространен в эстонии, чем северный диалект, и имел больший словарный запас и как раз на нем и говорило большинство эстонцев. Северный диалект стал доминировать только после того, как Эстония перешла к России, т.е. именно под влиянием России центр тяжести перенесся на север (где раньше заправляли шведы). Североэстонский диалект изобилует русицизмами и другими иностранными заимствованиями. Получается, что северное нац. меньшинство эстонцев навязала при поддержке России свой суржих истинным эстонцам, которые говорят на истинном эстонском (южно- эстонских диалектах).
http://listserv.brown.edu/archives/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0108b&L=conlang&F=&S=&P=9863
It should be said that a similar fate befell both languages until the end of the 1700s. Although the written South Estonian language was much closer to the language of people, richer in vocabulary, and the first one used in the translation of the New Testament in 1686, the Northern Estonian language obtained step by step greater significance especially during the period when the Russian Empire conquered Estonia from the Swedish kings in the beginning of 18th century. By the end of the century, there were more books in the North Estonian and there was a full translation of the Bible into Northern Estonian while the South had none.
http://www.lmp.ucla.edu/profe02.htm
LANGUAGE VARIATION
Two major dialect groups are generally identified, North Estonian (Tallinn) and South Estonian (Tartu). Some scholars consider them to be separate languages. A number of variants exist within the two major dialect groups. In South Estonian, for example, there are two additional divisions: the Mulgi dialects in the southwest, and the Voru Setu dialects in the southeast. North Estonian covers a larger area and can be broken down into several groups, including: the Insular dialect (spoken on the islands of Saaremaa and Hiiumaa,0); a northeastern coastal dialect (which shares a number of characteristics with Finnish,0); the Kodavere dialect (spoken in Kodavere and Maarja Magdaleena,0); and a western mainland dialect (spoken in Laanemaa, northern Parnumaa, and western Harjumaa). Despite the many divisions, all dialects and variants are mutually intelligible.
The present literary standard is based on North Estonian. However, South Estonian (or Tartu) has its own tradition of oral folk poetry that dates back at least 350 years.
-------------------
http://www.unhchr.ch/udhr/lang/est.htm
Dialects are grouped into three: North-eastern Coastal Estonian (between Tallinn and Narva), North Estonian (island, western, central, and eastern dialects), and South Estonian (Mulgi, Tartu, Vôru). The central dialect of North Estonian is the basis for the literary language. North Estonian became the chief language in 1739, when the Estonian translation of the Bible, an important standard-setter in this regard, was published. Vôru, and Setu (a subdialect of Vôru) are clearly distinct from standard Estonian.
http://www.phrasebase.com/languages/index.php?cat=77
ESTONIAN:Dialects are grouped into three: Northeastern Coastal Estonian (between Tallinn and Narva), North Estonian (island, western, central, and eastern dialects), and South Estonian (Mulgi, Tartu, Vôru). Vôru, Setu (a subdialect of Vôru), and island are clearly distinct from standard Estonian. All the other dialects are assimilated into standard Estonian. Those over 60 and under 20 speak little Russian. It is spoken less in rural areas and in southern areas. 75% to 80% of the population in the northeast are Russian speakers. Those over 60 know some German. Most in the north speak Finnish for common topics. Estonian has remained the language of education, including universities.
~If you obey all the rules, you miss all the fun~
Знаете, Лизард, у меня большие сомнения по поводу ваших знаний эстонских диалектов. Я не нашел точных цифр, но из того, что я нашел в инете ясно видно, что южный и северный эстонский диалект многие ученые даже рассматривают как два различных языка, южноэстонский был намного шире распространен в эстонии, чем северный диалект, и имел больший словарный запас и как раз на нем и говорило большинство эстонцев. Северный диалект стал доминировать только после того, как Эстония перешла к России, т.е. именно под влиянием России центр тяжести перенесся на север (где раньше заправляли шведы). Североэстонский диалект изобилует русицизмами и другими иностранными заимствованиями. Получается, что северное нац. меньшинство эстонцев навязала при поддержке России свой суржих истинным эстонцам, которые говорят на истинном эстонском (южно- эстонских диалектах).
http://listserv.brown.edu/archives/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0108b&L=conlang&F=&S=&P=9863
It should be said that a similar fate befell both languages until the end of the 1700s. Although the written South Estonian language was much closer to the language of people, richer in vocabulary, and the first one used in the translation of the New Testament in 1686, the Northern Estonian language obtained step by step greater significance especially during the period when the Russian Empire conquered Estonia from the Swedish kings in the beginning of 18th century. By the end of the century, there were more books in the North Estonian and there was a full translation of the Bible into Northern Estonian while the South had none.
http://www.lmp.ucla.edu/profe02.htm
LANGUAGE VARIATION
Two major dialect groups are generally identified, North Estonian (Tallinn) and South Estonian (Tartu). Some scholars consider them to be separate languages. A number of variants exist within the two major dialect groups. In South Estonian, for example, there are two additional divisions: the Mulgi dialects in the southwest, and the Voru Setu dialects in the southeast. North Estonian covers a larger area and can be broken down into several groups, including: the Insular dialect (spoken on the islands of Saaremaa and Hiiumaa,0); a northeastern coastal dialect (which shares a number of characteristics with Finnish,0); the Kodavere dialect (spoken in Kodavere and Maarja Magdaleena,0); and a western mainland dialect (spoken in Laanemaa, northern Parnumaa, and western Harjumaa). Despite the many divisions, all dialects and variants are mutually intelligible.
The present literary standard is based on North Estonian. However, South Estonian (or Tartu) has its own tradition of oral folk poetry that dates back at least 350 years.
-------------------
http://www.unhchr.ch/udhr/lang/est.htm
Dialects are grouped into three: North-eastern Coastal Estonian (between Tallinn and Narva), North Estonian (island, western, central, and eastern dialects), and South Estonian (Mulgi, Tartu, Vôru). The central dialect of North Estonian is the basis for the literary language. North Estonian became the chief language in 1739, when the Estonian translation of the Bible, an important standard-setter in this regard, was published. Vôru, and Setu (a subdialect of Vôru) are clearly distinct from standard Estonian.
http://www.phrasebase.com/languages/index.php?cat=77
ESTONIAN:Dialects are grouped into three: Northeastern Coastal Estonian (between Tallinn and Narva), North Estonian (island, western, central, and eastern dialects), and South Estonian (Mulgi, Tartu, Vôru). Vôru, Setu (a subdialect of Vôru), and island are clearly distinct from standard Estonian. All the other dialects are assimilated into standard Estonian. Those over 60 and under 20 speak little Russian. It is spoken less in rural areas and in southern areas. 75% to 80% of the population in the northeast are Russian speakers. Those over 60 know some German. Most in the north speak Finnish for common topics. Estonian has remained the language of education, including universities.
~If you obey all the rules, you miss all the fun~